Thursday, March 15, 2007

my favourite line from todays mahabharat

Krishna's rationale to Yudhistir for telling a lie that Ashwatthama is dead ... "When the ocean of milk is churned, there is Vish along with Amrut. The one who can drink the Vish is Lord Shiva !" If the Pandava's would have told the lie without the backing of Krishna it would have been a great adharma, now it is'nt ! So I guess the only important thing in life is identifying Krishna ... Whatever else you do, if you can do this ... that's it ...


Naren said...

Technically, Yudhishter did not lie. He announced "Ashwathama Hatha Kunjara(elephant)" Drona nevers gets hear the word Kunjara.. In fact they kill the elephant Ashwathama. I guess those days there were no Human Rights. What is Krishna's logic? Greater good is not devoid of evil?

Anonymous said...

I seem to have gone over to your other blog in error and just to reiterate my post there...

Thank you for visiting my blog (Why Zen) and creating an opportunity for me to ponder further. I have left the main response on my blog. I seem to be a little dumb today!! :-)

An interesting response here... "Geater good is not devoid of evil?" To me I would say, if all is one, surely evil cannot be excluded... But there again, how can the conditioned ego begin to even contemplate all being one? By mentioning "Krishna's logic" we are creating separation? By creating human rights, we are acknowledging human wrongs.. Yet we have to begin with logic, based on reason, based on opposites of truth and untruth. Where can it come in that there is only (one) Truth?

Anagha Mudigonda said...

When there is only God and no creation is in existence then there is no right and wrong, not truth and untruth for everything is Him.

Buth then, When the Lord creates the Universe and individual souls and the Illusion that the individual soul is separate from the Divine then there is separation of right from wrong and truth from untruth even though these maybe illusionary in the most abstract sense of the word ...

Reality has to be dealt with at each level. There is always a context to things is'nt there ? Because of the Theory or Relativity has been verified doesn’t necessarily mean Newton’s laws are wrong. For objects moving at velocities << speed of light, Newton’s laws still hold and are more appropriate to apply than the theory or relativity.
When there is a battle and people are killing each other then there is Just and Unjust .. When there is only the Divine contemplating itself then there is no right or wrong, truth or untruth, just or unjust .. The divine simply "Is".

Anonymous said...

Yes, we have paradox. All is one, yet.... but... We have the ifs and buts..

I wish to discover - in fact we all wish to discover - Nirvana. Forgive and move on. Yet I say, "in this world?!" How am I to forgive those responsible for murder and rape and all such hideous practices at work in the world today?

In Zen the intent is to liberate all beings. At the moment, this seems beyond me - I am of this relative world. Buddha said that we could all realise what he realised and that is my intent. I want it, yet he said that desire is the source of our sufferings.

If I find myself judging and blaming somebody for an act of (for example)murder, I just take it into my meditation. It goes round in my awareness and I feel my distaste and even anger, and then suddenly it will stop, and I'm feeling neutral to it. At this point I also begin to realise that it's the physical that has been "attacked" and that there's so much more... And this is where words just fail to describe or define what my consciousness has touched upon.

I "remember" I think before I learned to think, that I did not really want to be in this life. It wasn't suicidal, it was more like a reluctant student, finding himself in a class of lessons that seemed impossible. Then one day when I was about 8 years old, the reluctance seemed to transform into the idea that it wasn't so bad after-all. I wonder what I was seeing before? Another anwer that lies in the question.

Avadooth said...

Hi Anagha,

nice one here too..........

Let us start here with this

"God created the universe"

Question is with what?

What is the raw material?

Suppose someone says there is some raw material from which God created universe.

it means there are two things the first one being God and the second one being that raw material.

this defeats the definition of God as the omnipotent, omnipresent, and omniscient.(if raw material is not god, god cannot be omnipresent. since he is not omnipresent he is not omniscient and since he is not omniscient he is not omnipotent)

Suppose we say god himself is the raw material.

Questions are one. God evolved into this universe.

Evolution means the initial raw material changed to that extent that it has lost its initial characters and now it is in the form of the present world and universe with the present characteristics.

if it is correct
Evolution can be total Where the complete initial God got converted to universe...........Which means universe is there and no god (since it is total evolution)

if this is true....atheism....or the local chaarvaaka theory is correct.

Evolution can be partial where some part to the initial god got converted to universe and the other remained as himself/herself/itself.

if this is true advaitha philosophy is wrong. dvaitha philosophy is wrong as god is not omnipresent and antaryaami.

2. Case 2. if this universe is Gods dream.

We all are in his dream. (we are his dream)and that means he has no direct influence on us( or he has no control on us). Just like we have no control over our dreams ( mind you dream is different from imagination).

God doesnot have any direct influence on us..........God is not omnipotent.

Tell me if i am in a dream and i realize that everything i see here is dream (gods dream)and nothing else. is it possible for someone in dream to do something in dream that can wake the person who is dreaming. Impossible since everything done,said, thought, in dream is dream itself and it prolongs dream

it excludes individual salvation. The total dream should go at once when the dreamer (god) gets up. There can never be anyone who is self realized in the dream.

this exlcudes all practices, sathgurus, and all spiritual quests. becoz everything is dream.

3. Case 3.If this world is his imagination.

There is nothing called free will and will power. FAte is everything and destiny rules not purusha prayathna.

All good and bad are attributes of god and we have nothing to do with them.

This excludes karma theory.

Avadooth said...

Careful, careful,

it is not without a reasonable doubt that we can say anything about god or creation or universe.

what ever is said here or written here by me or anyone on this blog is nothing but their beliefs or mental impressions

to know something that is beyond logic, logic is useless.............

understanding the limitations of logic, practices, religion, science, and everything....

is the first and real step to understand the self

Avadooth said...

hi derek

forgive is not the word forget is the word

as i forget everything in deep sleep .......................good bad, evil and god, myself can be forgotten in deep sleep.

this is real self................

nothing else...........nothing else